a fellow blogger and former Facebook friend recently shared a video on Facebook because "she loved this video".
It was by a woman who was sharing make-up tips, life stuff, etc. You know there are more and more gals out there with this sort of thing ...
so I click over to watch the you tube presentation ... and I was more and more fascinated AND disturbed at the same time. certain aspects of the video were quite artistic and aesthetically appealing ... it wasn't only her sat in front of the screen but included breakaway shots and great music.
but when she was on the screen, there were times when it was, to me, too weird. her affect and body language were quite bizarre and she seemed strangely focused ... preoccupied with herself and in particular, her lips/mouth. her lips were obviously injected with something and seemed strangely out of place. now, this lady is a blogger and a youtube poster .. so it doesn't seem out of bounds to me to comment upon my reaction to viwing this shared video. and after viewing ten minutes or so of her video creation, the pièce de resistance was the ending , where we are treated to footage of her in the chair of a doctor? or aesthetician, receiving injections in her lips. again, her expressions during this segment were really disturbing to me.
so yeah I get that I don't know this woman and maybe she is a very nice person etc but that doesn't change the fact of my reaction ... and if she were my friend, I would be telling her my thoughts, albeit perhaps in a fashion more tailored to our friendship, knowledge of each other ... but still I would not be applauding this or masking my concerns simply because she is SO NICE or she is MY FRIEND or other excuses. that is not true friendship. in my world anyway.
I will share a link at the end here so you can all jump on the bully bandwagon if you choose!
in any event, after watching this ... my reaction was yuk, that was really creepy, and I commented as such. she is also quite thin, and I threw in the fact that someone needs to give her a sandwich ... ha ha. to be fair I also commented on the lovely editing work and her great shoes. granted, I probably could have worded my viewpoint more kindly, but hey that isn't my strong point.
this was all on facebook. well, within seconds someone chided me for being mean and also for being mean on this sweet person's blog.
I answered back that sweet person knew me and that I was always direct.
and then in a few sentences I also commented on what i think is the crux of the matter, that there are lots of females, young and old, watching these make-uppy things and these types of blogs/videos are just like the twisted U.S. media ... creating ideals for women that are so off kilter. I also stated that this woman appeared to me to have a preoccupation with her lips , reinforced by the ending and it was creepy.
well with the time difference and all, it took a day to realize sweet person had summarily deleted me from her page and then proceed to join in on disparaging me as a bully, a mean girl, why can't women just be nice,oh and let's not forget envious, ugly and childish (all quotes of sweet person) blah blah blah. no consideration for the content of my comment, no opportunity to respond, etc. at a minimum, I am an acquaintance of this person for some time now and yet not even the courtesy of a note questioning my remarks ... nada. Its a shame, really because this is an interesting topic and opening a dialogue amongst a group of women would be far more productive than immediately shutting it down in the guise of being nice ... good manners ... how mean and all. a missed opportunity. but hey, maybe this is a sensitive topic for sweet person as well. which also bears reflection ...
sweet person, whom I have actually met and corresponded with over the course of the few years I have had my blog, is a licensed therapist and frankly I also found it disturbing that she would be giving kudos to someone who appears to have some issues. she also apparently forgot she had added me as a friend through my shop and that I could still see the page there. Funny in a way but also ironic and a little sad ... but hey, I wanted to have a forum to respond and so here I am!!! lol
so what say you? is criticism bullying? when someone shares something for public consumption are we supposed to keep our viewpoints to ourselves unless they are "nice"? and in this particular example, is this something you'd want your daughter to watch and applaud, maybe even emulate?
My answer is no on all counts ... what is yours?
this is the link to the video, sometimes it is up and sometimes it is blocked as private ...
PS- I am adding this postscript to further explain my statement, "I will share a link at the end here so you can all jump on the bully bandwagon if you choose!".
As a result of a couple of commenters, I can see how this could be misinterpreted as my urging people to take part in bullying the video or video maker.
My message was meant to signify - here, I am providing you with a link to the video. Watch it and decide for yourself if you think I am a bully with the comments I have described. If you think I am a bully, you can jump on the bandwagon with Tracey Cleantis and her Facebook gang and let me know.
I was going to just reword my original post ... but as it seems there is some group attention continuing out there, I wouldn't want to appear deceitful....
Tuesday, December 21, 2010
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25 comments:
Not quite on point but I have just showed this video to my husband and 28 year old son who were about. Their faces were such a picture.......... She is beyond weird, definitely eating disorder and who knows what else.
But, basically I am a wimp. I would not comment at all. The only time I comment in any way negatively it is very very carefully thought about and never immediately.
Don't think you're going to miss much by not being this person's 'friend' any more!
Look, if you want to put something on youtube then you must be open to comments, be it good or bad. I saw the video and it's strange and who wants to see her get botox and lip injections. We all have our opinions and I'm proud of you for speaking your mind.
I think your facebook/blogger friend doesn't know what friend is, or she wasn't your real friend to begin with because if she was she would have sent you a note and said "what's up?" You don't need people like that in your life anyway.
People just don't like to hear the truth, they want everything beautiful and fake! You're the real deal and I love you for your honesty and that you speak your mind.
xo
It's simple: If she can't take the heat, then she should get out of the kitchen. There are no sacred cows when it comes to freedom of speech and expression.
Maggie May
some of the reactions I have received on FB assure me I am not alone in my reaction ... excerpts:
* I thought you'd be exaggerating but that is quite bizarre in exactly the way you describe. Particularly the dermal filler dude "We're not, in any way, doing, anything...unnatural..."
*I'm a bully too! Yay! I told my husband that this means that we are perfectly "integrated". HA!*
1 personLoading...
* Bloody hell, Kim! That is scary and frankly, extremely disturbing stuff. I've truly never in my life seen anything like that. Sheltered life, huh? I thought at first she (the woman on the video) was trying to be funny (didn't see your so...-called bullying as I no longer read the updates on the other person's facebook). It actually makes me feel quite ill to see women taking this shit seriously.
It also makes me love my soft saggy bits, grey roots and life-lines on my face a little more.
Where I come from, criticism and opinion is not bullying, it's the stuff of healthy communication.S*
*oh. wait. I didn't actually watch the video until now. I think that was strange and a bit sick!
rosie- you probably stay out of hot water that way! and I'm sure you're right about no great loss...
alisa- thanks my dear, I know my bluntness could be toned down a bit but even if every disparaging word about me/my style were true ... that still doesn't remove the subject of the obvious issues of the video maker ...
maggie may- thanks darlin' and by the way, damn straight! xx
Did you just need your girl friends to make you feel better about yourself and agree with you?
Criticism IS bullying. Especially when you encourage your readers to "jump on the bully bandwagon!"
And you say "I probably could have worded my viewpoint more kindly, but hey that isn't my strong point."
Yes, you've made clear that your strong point is NOT being kind. Congrats.
Mara ... here one is entitled to their opinion and to voice it.
Criticism is the source by which many of us grow...or find help... or teach others. You mistook my call to jump on the bully bandwagon, what that meant was here is the video watch and, if you agree that I am a bully, jump on the bandwagon. so thanbks for the opportunity to clarify as I now see how that might not have been well worded.
so yah, thanks but it is not new news that my strong point is not niceness. I am a work in progress.
but as I have discussed with the mutual acuaintances of sweet person and I, what I really find interesting is that even if you take all of the accusations towards me as true ... what NO one addresses, including you ... is the point of my original posting.
The behavior exhibited in the video is not to be lauded. especially by a therapist. the gal needs help and, even if you don't like my delivery ... the message is still valid.
The message IS valid and important... Many women have been convinced that there is something very wrong with their faces and bodies if they do not resemble the full-lipped, nipped-waisted, long-legged versions of womanhood - THAT is the material point. I think it is essential that we point out this illogical leap whenever we can. Besides, if you are looking to be offended, you surely will be...
Everyone is entitled to their opinions and I'm a proponent for freedom of speech. However, if you cannot remain classy (and I'm saying this with lighter hand than I would like)in which you express those opinions, then you, my friend, are indeed a bully. Also, what's up with telling others to watch the video and jump on the "bandwagon"? What are you missing in your life where you feel the need to express said opinions with such discord and distaste?
I saw the video and in no way did I feel like she was exhibiting narcissism.
All I see is an open lady with a love for an avante garde look and way of life.
Nowhere do I see a message of "don't accept yourself for who you are". If anything, I read the contrary and commend her for being open and honest about her fillers. Body altering has been around for thousands of years. Feet binding, neck lengthening, tattoos, and so on. Who knows, she could have had similar to what she does now when she was younger.
Live and let live.
Maybe if you reviewed yourself a bit more you wouldn't waste such time on these "opinions" of others.
dandylion-I agree and you expressed that viewpoint much more elegantly than I.
anonymous - I thought I explained the 'bandwagon' comment above but I will also add a PS to my post. I was sarcastically telling folks to watch the video and then if they think my comments were unjust bullying, they could jump on Tracey Cleantis' and friends bandwagon...which you just did of course.
thanks for your comments however because the do spark a curious reaction in me and in essence, reinforce my point. of course all sorts of body altering have taken place throughout history until now ... and some are beautiful and supportable and others are dangerous. You can't just group everything together as defensible because they've been around a long time or were popular in society. Take your example of footbinding. I'm assuming you know the history behind why women's feet were bound. yes this was 'body-altering'...are you suggesting that if a friend of yours decided to bind her daughter's feet you would not say anything but leave it as a time honored practice? I think you have provided a perfect parallel to some of today's procedures where women feel inclined to inject their bodies with poisons to achieve an impossible ideal put forth by a male dominated and youth-oriented media. From the younger photos of Donna Artz (on her FB page) one sees an absolutely beautiful woman sans fillers and the like. Yes she has the right to do whatever she chooses with her body. But as I stated before, when it comes to putting forth that image for public consumption and in some cases, as a role model for others ... I equally have the right to speak my view.
I am glad you commented as I think a dialogue on this topic is warranted and does not have to be suppressed, deleted or kept anonymous.
oh and yes, there are typos. :)
The fact that you even have to ask if you are a bully, is telling.
There was nothing in that video, that in any way warranted your disgraceful attack on this lady.
If you don't care for injectables, then say so. Leave it at that.
No, posting a video on YouTube does entitle anyone to attack or belittle.
I cannot for the life of me, understand why you felt that such unkind remarks would be considered decent conduct? Or warranted?
This lady is recent widow, having cared for her spouse as his illness overtook their lives, and he passed away in August. I am also a widow, and losing weight is not unusual.
If this lady chooses to do anything for herself, anything at all, that brings her joy or pleasure, not harming anyone else, not espousing that it is the right choice for anyone but herself, then who are you to say differently??
Ah but I do get from what you have stated and written, that you have decided that you will be the arbiter of individual rights...
Well I am one woman who has no desire to follow your mandate in life, and especially where is involves judgemental, thoughtless and disrespectful thinking and actions. Such as bullying in a public forum.
Perhaps you are the one that requires the therapy?
Care, it is true that I did not know that this woman was a widow. Being a widow myself, I agree that it is an awful loss to experience and focusing on something we love as a distraction to cope is often therapeutic.
I did not 'find' her video on youtube, however, it was shared by someone I know, who is a therapist, and who instead of 'loving it' and pro,oting it should perhaps be trying to support her in some way ... because maybe she is taking things too far ... as evidenced when watching the video and some of the behavior exhibited.
No I don't agree with 'injectables' (what a nice convenient catch word for a dangerous practice) nor do I agree they should be promoted on a site such as youtube. it goes beyond making a personal choice when you film yourself receiving them, when the practitioner is lauding them as natural, and when countless women view these images. that is promoting it as an option for others.
It is trendy these days to categorize all sorts of things, including dissent, as bullying. Regqrdless if you or others believe it, I am truly sorry for her loss. I am not surprised now that I know, because she has the look of someone at a loss.
In retrospect, if I would have known this ... perhaps I would have contacted Tracey directly with my thoughts. perhaps not. If I, in my own situation of loss some years ago, had been taking these same actions ... I hope someone would have spoken out to me in honest concern.
I have already acknowledged that my original comments could have been worded more politely. but the message is still the same and worthy of discussion.
The terrorists have won.
anon-lol @ that which could be interpreted a multitude of ways/
if having an opinion is now even more than bullying but terrorism, you make me laugh/
if you are joking, you make me laugh/
a win/win situation!
Check out Gurugossip two threads on Donna - a rave and one trashing her.
Yes! I agree with you entirely. Donnashorts1 is doing a disservice to women everywhere.
Her videos are not really about makeup - they merely provide a vehicle for Donnashorts1 to preen onscreen and show off those scary lips.
I have never learned anything from watching her videos except how much in love with herself she is.
The trouble with Americans is that they are so PC any criticism is regarded as cruel and bullying.
Her obssession with herself is creepy. Why don't her friends tell her?
Let's just break this down to what it really is.
You're a mean girl with a vendetta. What did Donna do to you? Do tell.
Steal your man? Kick your dog? Piss on your cereal?
No.
She simply exists and is enjoying her life. Who made you the lip or weight loss police? You are a bully and a hater. I find you disgusting in what you do.
In a world where women should be supporting each other, you choose instead to ridicule. If Donna or any other female wants to get her lips injected or her butt liposuctioned or her boobs lifted, where in the rule book of life does that give you license to judge? It doesn't!
Back to my original statement. You are just MEAN and you enjoy it! I would wager you lunch with your girlie friends and as soon as they walk away in their designer shoes and pretty hair- with their heads held high you bash them to anyone that will listen to you. What? Are you that damn ugly and insecure? Women that are happy with themselves do not bash and trash others on blogs or elsewhere, they support each other. Try it.
It's very gratifying to compliment another woman. Make her day. Perhaps she doesn't have the best looks, the best lips (You seem to have a hangup with lips) the best clothes etc but a small compliment can make a difference to a woman that may need it just that one day in her life.
Oh, but I forgot, You would rather cut a woman down for being herself. You are the Lip Police. You are the Body Patrol of the Universe. Sad and pathetic.
I stand for ALL women, not just Donna. Why? Because it's the right thing to do.
Go back to your cabinet that you crawled out of, it smells of cockroaches in here.
interesting how you remain anonymous. but thanks for sharing your view. as mentioned before, all opinions are welcome... chapeau!
I'm keeping this short because your poorly-written, hyper-emotionally charged rant is long-winded and illogical. Made this point several months ago, but since I doubt you possess any semblance of objectivity (or enough sense to read through other feedback) I will restate: "Donna if you can't take the heat, get the f**k out of the kitchen". Donna wouldn't last 24 hours in corporate America. Lastly, since when is constructive criticism deemed bashing? Here is my wager: unlike Donna or yourself for that matter, the writer of je ne regrette rien, clearly wouldn't wait for the "girlie friends [to] walk away in their designer shoes and pretty hair" to bash them. She possesses the balls to share the feedback (if necessary) with them before they walk away. Shit, I'm of the opinion that there is a shortage of candid friends and mirrors on this Earth!!!! Speaking of balls, you should consider signing your post; if you took the time to compile an illogical rant, you should at a mínimum, stand by your words. My $0.02.
Maggie May
Maggie May
Your seem like a pompous know-it-all completely full of yourself. And you criticize this woman for her content on youtube? Glad I could dazzle you with my profundities.
I'd be embarrassed to identify myself as well, if that were the best I could come up with... 4 years later. guess news travels slow in Kansas.
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